Swing and Big Band CD sales figures

[Eyeball]

I asked a friend of mine about a low sales rumor I had heard from a third party. He was a producer for a major label until recently.

someone told me a lot of these big bands CDs of even the biggest names on the biggest labels don't sell more than a few hundred copies each world wide. How could that be? Why would they even bother?

Hey John,

That's quite true. At XXX there was technically a minimum guarantee of 2,500, but most titles didn't sell anywhere near that. As long as the client was making the bottom line due to certain top titles, we didn't bother them too much about individual guarantees.

The reason none of this stuff gets out through frontline labels is that they'll only produce stuff that they think will sell about 25,000 units.

I hate thinking about all that old record company crap. The industry is over. I had a nice little run before the older audience died and the internet took the interest of younger potential buyers.

How dismal is that??

[Haydn]

I asked a friend of mine about a low sales rumor I had heard from a third party. He was a producer for a major label until recently.

"I had a nice little run before the older audience died and the internet took the interest of younger potential buyers."

How dismal is that??

I don't quite understand your point - are you upset that people are buying online instead of buying CDs?

[Eyeball]

I don't quite understand your point - are you upset that people are buying online instead of buying CDs?

Yes- that is essentially it. An industry has died and a way of marketing that many people devoted their lives to is gone.

Their was pride in being a music retailer with a business that people drove for miles to come to because you had the product and the knowledge and you could meet like minded people in person.

[dogpossum]

I'm kinda digging on the fact that I suddenly have access to all sorts of rare music that I couldn't get before.
I also like it that I've 'met' plenty of people from smaller record labels all over the world via email.
I love it that I can learn about music and musicians in conversations with friends all over the country and the world, using resources which are free and easily accessed.
I like it that my entire music collection fits in my backpack, and that it (and I) can ride my bike across town to gigs without breaking my back.
And I like it most of all that I can get a-hold of music immediately.


So I guess you can put me down as 'for' the interwebs.

[fredo]

I don't quite understand your point - are you upset that people are buying online instead of buying CDs?

Yes- that is essentially it. An industry has died and a way of marketing that many people devoted their lives to is gone.

Their was pride in being a music retailer with a business that people drove for miles to come to because you had the product and the knowledge and you could meet like minded people in person.

I agree that it's sad when people have to give up their businesses due to declining market. I think because we're living through this technological shift that these stories can have more sentiment to some of us. I know when Bud's Jazz Records when out of business here in Seattle that many people were bummed.

This has been going on for centuries though. I'm sure certain business owners felt similarly when large retail mail-order catalogs started becoming popular. It's sad if you're on the losing end of these trends, but it also opens opportunities for new ideas that reach more people.

As for driving for miles to go to a store, I think the online revolution is a social benefit. We wouldn't be having this discussion with people all over the world if communication hadn't evolved to be more accessible. Now I can get the product I want, and chat with like minded people without the barriers of traveling.

I had a nice little run before the older audience died and the internet took the interest of younger potential buyers.

The thing is, the internet didn't take away interest, new musical preferences did that. The internet actually makes the music we love MORE accessible to younger buyers that might be interested.

[Eyeball]

I'm kinda digging on the fact that I suddenly have access to all sorts of rare music that I couldn't get before.
I also like it that I've 'met' plenty of people from smaller record labels all over the world via email.
I love it that I can learn about music and musicians in conversations with friends all over the country and the world, using resources which are free and easily accessed.
I like it that my entire music collection fits in my backpack, and that it (and I) can ride my bike across town to gigs without breaking my back.
And I like it most of all that I can get a-hold of music immediately.


So I guess you can put me down as 'for' the interwebs.

Then you totally do not understand what it is that has been lost.
That's just the way it is.

[Eyeball]

I had a nice little run before the older audience died and the internet took the interest of younger potential buyers.

The thing is, the internet didn't take away interest, new musical preferences did that. The internet actually makes the music we love MORE accessible to younger buyers that might be interested.

"New musical preferences" were always available and were the choice of the majority of listeners. He meant the young potential buyers of CDs.

Yes, the web made the music more instantaneously available.

[CountBasi]

I agree that it's sad when people have to give up their businesses due to declining market. I think because we're living through this technological shift that these stories can have more sentiment to some of us. I know when Bud's Jazz Records when out of business here in Seattle that many people were bummed.
......

Was that the shop you had to go down the steps to from the street very near King St Station (I think it was on Jackson St but not sure????).

[lipi]

I agree that it's sad when people have to give up their businesses due to declining market. I think because we're living through this technological shift that these stories can have more sentiment to some of us. I know when Bud's Jazz Records when out of business here in Seattle that many people were bummed.
......

Was that the shop you had to go down the steps to from the street very near King St Station (I think it was on Jackson St but not sure????).

yes, unfortunately.

[CountBasi]

Then add me to the bummed group

[dogpossum]

Then you totally do not understand what it is that has been lost.
That's just the way it is.

So, what exactly has 'been lost'? And in what context?

I had assumed your post was discussing CDs specifically. Not record shops.


I'm not exactly crying about the loss of CDs when there're so many other, awesome ways of acquiring music.
I wonder if the relative cheapness of producing digital music (without the costs of pressing CDs/records, printing covers, managing physical distribution, etc) might mean an increase in the dissemination of 'less profitable' music online? I know it's not a good idea to generalise from so few examples, but:
- I can't help but think of the Chron Classics on emusic: a wonderful series of music suddenly made available on emusic. Including the 'out of print' CDs. Too expensive to buy second hand, but cheap and accessible via downloads.
- Not to mention edison cylinders. Not too many of those turning up in my local record shop. But the internet has suddenly given me access to something quite rare and wonderful.

For me, digital online providers have increased my access to olden days jazz.
There is obviously space for niche marketing and production online. I think that new technologies facilitate the sort of preservationist projects we're interested in, in a way that old school record and CD production do not.

So, I say again: I'm down with the intertubes.

[dogpossum]

This has nothing to do with swing and big band record sales, but it's really interesting. This is the introductory paragraph of a discussion about records shops (and book shops and film shops) in the context of community development and local community culture. There are some dodgy points, but it's an interesting reworking of some of the ideas that come up on swingdjs. You can read the entire article here.

TITLE Music and Film, and the importance of being locally-owned

Locally-owned independent retailers contribute a vast amount to cities. Equally, it's almost impossible to see how national or multinational chains genuinely contribute much to cities at all.

That's not to say that national retailers don't have a place - the Mujis of this world clearly contribute a great deal, economically but also symbolically, as cultural goods. But they don't contribute to cities in the same way.

Exploring numerous cities worldwide leads to an almost instinctive understanding of this, but recent research from the US indicates that between 54 and 58 cents of every dollar spent at a locally-owned retailer stays in that local environment, as they tend to employ a local accountant, a local delivery service, local web designer, local graphic designer and signwriter, local architect, advertise in the local paper, and so on. A national store contributes only 15 cents to the local environment, for every dollar spent, as they tend to centralise those same functions in order to induce greater efficiency. (The research was cited by Stacy Mitchell, author of The Hometown Advantage, on the excellent Smart Cities radio show/podcast, in a show marking the 25th anniversary of Miami's Books & Books store.)

I somehow doubt there's much in the way of jazz we're interested in at this shop. But I'll go check it out.

[falty411]

This sucks! All of these betamax companies are going out of business because of this new fangled "VCR" BS

if you dont change your business model and ignore trends, there is a pretty good chance youll get left in the dust.