SwingDJs

Shanabanana wrote:The 4G Ipod docks have a "line out" port, which makes the sound quality good enough to play over a sound system. Lovin mine.

Is it posssible then for you to preview any tracks?

LindyChef wrote:

CafeSavoy wrote:Do you mean like a iPod or something similar? I think if you're going to be a digital dj you should have some backups because computers can go down on you when you least expect it.

Exactly. I'm in the process of getting an iPod for myself for that reason (and, as a general rule, I always carry around a copy of my Windows XP CD for recovery purposes).

I always have my iPod with me. I was in Houston when the logic board on my ibook decided to go south on me.

Jerry, I think I finally got all that "swing" music from my ipod on to my power book.

sonofvu wrote:...snip....Jerry, I think I finally got all that "swing" music from my ipod on to my power book.

So that's what that was......... Good sets this weekend at ALX, George..

GemZombie wrote:Been using a mp3+ for a while, it's the perfect little addition to a laptop DJ set up.

Good deal on the rebates and such. Unless you have a reason to have even more outputs, this is definitely my recommendation for secondary sound.

I notice that the mp3+ is a "16bit" sound card whereas other soundcards are "24bit". From my limited understanding, this measurement has to do with the DAC bandwitch (data acquisition). I was reading somewhere that it has nothing to do with sound reproduction, but a computer engineering friend of mine said it would affect sound quality. Does anyone have a definitive answer on this?

Basically, unless you have software/harware that is going to do some interpolation, you're not going to get any benefit because of our audio sources (and even then that's dubious since you're filling in information that's not really there). CDs, are sampled as 16-bit, 44.1 kHz PCM audio. If you playback at 24 bit, you're not actually adding anything to it.

Look at it this way. When you sample at 16 bit, you have 65,536 possible audio levels ... when you sample at 24 bit you have 16,777,216 possible levels. So you get more precision in what the audio level is at that moment in time if your source is in 24-bit. Otherwise, those same 16-bit data points are in that 24-bit set, so there should be no difference in playback with a 16-bit sound card.

Now once we get audio sources that are recording at 24-bits (SACD, DVD-A, your own recordings of concerts, etc) and use them, then you will see the benefit, maybe, if you're an audiophile and have the right setup. In a DJ's environment, that's kinda questionable to me.

Some people might contend they hear a difference, but I would put a 16 bit sound card with a 16 bit recording next to a 24 bit sound card (with all interpolation disabled) with that same 16 bit recording in a blind test and challenge a user to hear the difference.

falty411 wrote:Is it posssible then for you to preview any tracks?

Nope, I was previewing on my laptop. Weird, I know, but I don't have an external sound card on it, so it's just a glorified search engine at the moment.

Using the on-the-go playlist to DJ with works ok, but it's a little delicate. If you mess up, it's tough to get right back on it. OK for a casual venue, but I won't be using it for a big deal any time soon.

LindyChef wrote:Basically, unless you have software/harware that is going to do some interpolation, you're not going to get any benefit because of our audio sources (and even then that's dubious since you're filling in information that's not really there). CDs, are sampled as 16-bit, 44.1 kHz PCM audio. If you playback at 24 bit, you're not actually adding anything to it.

Look at it this way. When you sample at 16 bit, you have 65,536 possible audio levels ... when you sample at 24 bit you have 16,777,216 possible levels. So you get more precision in what the audio level is at that moment in time if your source is in 24-bit. Otherwise, those same 16-bit data points are in that 24-bit set, so there should be no difference in playback with a 16-bit sound card.

Now once we get audio sources that are recording at 24-bits (SACD, DVD-A, your own recordings of concerts, etc) and use them, then you will see the benefit, maybe, if you're an audiophile and have the right setup. In a DJ's environment, that's kinda questionable to me.

Some people might contend they hear a difference, but I would put a 16 bit sound card with a 16 bit recording next to a 24 bit sound card (with all interpolation disabled) with that same 16 bit recording in a blind test and challenge a user to hear the difference.

So the "internal" vs "external" soundcard debate is more about the crappy soundcards in laptops themselves then (or possibly noise interference from internal cards)?

Ya, the soundcards in laptops are crap. I can't say exactly WHAT is crappy about them exactly, but there's a very noticible difference in sound quality when I go between my uber-dell internal sound card and my external mp3+.

I've HEARD that it has to do w/a serious lack of shielding because of the compressed space, but who knows. My guess is just cheap parts, although regular internal sound cards are sooooo cheap that I have a hard time imagining a laptop sound card being particularly expensive.

JohnDyer wrote:So the "internal" vs "external" soundcard debate is more about the crappy soundcards in laptops themselves then (or possibly noise interference from internal cards)?

Yeah, it's the interference from the other electrical parts in your computer. Try this as a test. Take your headphones and plug them into your laptop's sound card, have no audio source playing and crank up the volume to max. Even on the best ones, you'll hear a little hiss, hum, something ... that's poor shielding ... you're amplifying the interference along with the original audio source, which is going to sound like crap ... that's why I use my laptop's audio source as my cue and my external sound card as my output.

JohnDyer wrote:

GemZombie wrote:Been using a mp3+ for a while, it's the perfect little addition to a laptop DJ set up.

Good deal on the rebates and such. Unless you have a reason to have even more outputs, this is definitely my recommendation for secondary sound.

I notice that the mp3+ is a "16bit" sound card whereas other soundcards are "24bit". From my limited understanding, this measurement has to do with the DAC bandwitch (data acquisition). I was reading somewhere that it has nothing to do with sound reproduction, but a computer engineering friend of mine said it would affect sound quality. Does anyone have a definitive answer on this?

As far as I know, it could technically affect sound quality reproduction if the device that's doing the playback and the source are both capable of 24bit, but I'll tell you right now you won't notice the difference from yoru cd source, or your mp3 source

JohnDyer wrote: So the "internal" vs "external" soundcard debate is more about the crappy soundcards in laptops themselves then (or possibly noise interference from internal cards)?

Internal laptop sound cards often have pops and hiss in them due to electronic noise that can be eliminated with a decent external card.

Not all laptops suffer from the bad internal card though.

GuruReuben wrote:

Just install two instances of the latest version of WinAmp. After playing with iTunes and WinAmp for a while, this is the route I'll be taking.

a couple questions on this...are you using two sound cards for this setup? (one internal, one external) i tried installing two instances of winamp and i wasn't able to, also are there ANY sound cards out there that can simultaneously play two streams at once? Should I just assume that mine cannot and that I should buy an external?

also does anyone know of a cheap external usb sound card that takes usb 2.0 and is smaller than the size of a video tape?

Thanks guys for the 24 vs 16bit answer. I've been wondering about that for a long time. For my purposes, a 16bit card should work just fine. I have an Extigy now, but have been shopping for smaller external cards that don't require a power source - it's such a pain to plug everything in. I finally got my iRiver 40GB mp3 player/hard drive - it has a rechargeable battery that easily lasts for a dj gig (and plays other formats, and has an FM tuner, and has a voice recorder etc.)

I too preview from my laptop internal soundcard, and I do notice some hum at the higher volumes with it.

AlekseyKosygin wrote:are you using two sound cards for this setup?

My guess is yes. That's what I did when I was using this setup this past Saturday night.

AlekseyKosygin wrote:i tried installing two instances of winamp and i wasn't able to

You actually don't install two instances, you simply run two instances of the same winamp. There's an option underneath General Preferences that when checked "allows multiple instances".

AlekseyKosygin wrote:also does anyone know of a cheap external usb sound card that takes usb 2.0 and is smaller than the size of a video tape?

That iMic was pretty small. I like my powerwave, but it's $100 and so probably doesn't qualify as cheap.

I spun ORLX on a 1 gHz 12" PowerBook with a factory sound card and a 15GB iPod for cueing, previewing, and backup.

DJ-1800 is the DJ app to use if you're on a Mac (and if not, well...that's another thread). Basically it's a Denon DN-1800F setup on your desktop: