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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 12:54 pm
by Nate Dogg
Jerry_Jelinek wrote: First, like many of you, I'm amazed that anyone can completely dismiss
an entire career worth of music based on a small sampling.
When you have the time, you should go through all the past threads, there is some amazing stuff in there.

Nathan

Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 12:59 pm
by GemZombie
CafeSavoy wrote: I find it interesting that people will exclude entire artists because some of their songs are cheesy or because they only have one or two good songs per cd.
Nah, I'll play the good tunes. I'm just disappointed in a CD when there are only a few good songs on it. It does, however, mean i may not buy albums if i know there is only one or two songs on it. I hate speding $12-15 for one song.

Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 2:33 pm
by djstarr
So can anyone recommend air-check transcriptions by Harry James? At our hot jazz hang out last night Casey MacGill stopped by (I really am not trying to name drop here, but he lives in Seattle now and is buddies with one of our friends who comes out there).

I asked him his opinion of Harry James, he thought the air-check transcriptions swung really hard; I assume this means live recordings, although perhaps someone here can tell me if that term has a more specific meaning.

There is this listing on amazon, but it says it's out of stock:
Live Broadcasts

Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 2:30 pm
by Jerry_Jelinek
Hi all,

Here is some new fun.

I put up on the following web site 10 MP3s of 50s bands that I enjoy.

I think all of these, except the bonus clip, would be good for swing dancing. You decide.

After a week or so, I'll put the answers up.

Enjoy:

wkhr.org/SwingDJs

Jerry

BTW - there may just be some Harry James there !!!

Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 12:03 am
by kbuxton
I think I just found my personal "cheese" threshhold... strings.

Posted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 11:25 am
by kitkat
kbuxton wrote:I think I just found my personal "cheese" threshhold... strings.
I have a comment above tracks: "Strings!" It keeps me from previewing 30 seconds of a song, thinking it'll work, and having a nasty surprise. But I suppose then we're more talking about the 30's and things directly inspired by its greatest pop composers than the 50's.

Posted: Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:24 am
by JesseMiner
Jerry_Jelinek wrote:I put up on the following web site 10 MP3s of 50s bands that I enjoy.

I think all of these, except the bonus clip, would be good for swing dancing. You decide.
Thanks for putting these clips up. I gave them all a thorough listen. Most of them would definitely be well-received by swing dancers. My only criticism as a dance DJ would be that a few had portions with overly "sweet"-sounding horn unison parts (something that's very not popular among dancers in 30s or 40s recordings either) or moments of blasting horns overwhelming the rhythm section, something that was really common in the 50s big bands. These portions were short though and did not overwhelm the full length of the clips I heard. I dug that version of "Roll 'Em" - much nicer than Billy May's version from the Time Life series. You've got some great taste!

Jesse

PS - I just edited a spelling error.

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 7:11 am
by julius
hey keep those clips around until i get back stateside thursday!!

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:46 am
by Jerry_Jelinek
julius wrote:hey keep those clips around until i get back stateside thursday!!
They will be still be there. Based on the 3 responses, with 2 being less than enthusiastic, I'll leave them there for some time.

Don't rush back just to hear them though.

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 2:43 pm
by djstarr
I've only had time to listen to the first 5 --- one I really really liked, a couple I would try out and two I wouldn't play at all. I'll post more thoughts once I've finished listening to the rest of them; there is enough difference in the rhythms on the clips that I think it's worth discussing in detail.

Thanks for taking the time to upload them Jerry!

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 2:55 pm
by Jerry_Jelinek
djstarr wrote:.... I think it's worth discussing in detail.

Thanks for taking the time to upload them Jerry!
Thanks for the time. That is really what I'm looking for. Is this track danceable or not? Why yes or no? I'm not into generalities like 'this clip sucks'. That to me adds nothing to the conversation.

I would appreciate a more detailed response. That will only help me to understand what makes a swing track more enjoyable to dancers.

Thanks

Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 4:28 pm
by Mr Awesomer
Song Clip 1
Negatives: High hatting, boring, annoying horn arrangements (both the mute work and the blaring), lack of substance.
Positives: None

Song Clip 2
Negatives: High hatting… totally kills this one. Feels thin with just the high hatting and horns. Sax starts to add.
Positives: None.

Song Clip 3
Negatives: Here comes the blaring horns again. "Cheesy" melody.
Positives: Enjoyed the drummer.

Song Clip 4
Negatives: Sounds like a source of inspiration for the horrid Neo-Swing bands of today. Yet again with the blaring horns.
Positives: None.

Song Clip 5
Negatives: Boring, monotonous. Was that a Baritone horn I heard?
Positives: None.

Song Clip 6
Negatives: Fucking strings! "Cheese" all around.
Positives: None.

Song Clip 7
Negatives: Annoying high hatting (worst offender of all tracks.) Sounds better uptempo.
Positives: None.

Song Clip 8
Negatives: There's that high hatting again, but almost acceptable. On the boring side, but not terribly boring.
Positives: Enjoyed the bass player.

Song Clip 9
Negatives: More high hatting. Just… boring… and "cheesy."
Positives: Enjoyed the rhythm guitar.

Some common denominators (or at least things that apply to the majority) about these tracks are: Horn arrangements that just don't do it for me, that heavy on the high hat style of drumming that drives me up the wall, and many of these tracks sound as if they were recorded in a cave (those lovely 50's echo effects, ugh.)

Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 2:42 am
by julius
Not having heard the clips, are you sure you don't mean "ride cymbal" instead of "high hat"? The hi-hat goes 'psh ting a ting' and the ride cymbal goes "ping ping a ping". Most classic swing songs use the hi-hat extensively but the ride somewhat sparingly, although the noise reduction process usually eliminates the high hat entirely.

Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 2:45 am
by djstarr
For the most part I agree with Reuben. All tracks except for 3 and 10 have the riding high-hat which I find somewhat annoying, especially when the cymbals are loud enough to compete with the horns -- i think it's the continuous repetition of the sound that is grating. (and even the Ellington stuff from Newport has a lot of high-hat ride, which is too bad).

I'd DJ clip 3 more than once. I find it happy and with big energy, it's almost corny, but it would work well at times.

Too bad clip 8 has too much high hat ride, I like the bass solo, energy and the softer horn arrangements.

Clip 10 had me looking for Desi Arnez :-) There is too much latin/swing that is really good which you can't play that often, so I wouldn't waste a slot on this clip.

Clip 2 has the highest cheese factor for me - there is something trite in the melody in addition to the high hat ride.

Any drummers in the crowd? The high hat ride still continues through modern jazz, but it gets toned down in smaller combos. You never hear it in 30's and 40's big band tracks --- where did it come from?

Hope this helps Jerry --- how do you feel about Chick Webb? His drumming really makes you want to dance.

There is a lot of Jimmie Lunceford that qualifies as corny IMHO, but it's still fun to dance to - such as "On the beach in Bali-bali" - happy happy song, but it has great rhythm.

Posted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 2:47 am
by djstarr
julius wrote:Not having heard the clips, are you sure you don't mean "ride cymbal" instead of "high hat"? The hi-hat goes 'psh ting a ting' and the ride cymbal goes "ping ping a ping". Most classic swing songs use the hi-hat extensively but the ride somewhat sparingly, although the noise reduction process usually eliminates the high hat entirely.
so my clever "high hat ride" phrase is a misnomer? Based on your description it's the ride cymbal. Very prevalent in most of the clips Jerry uploaded.