50s bands for swing dancing

[Jerry_Jelinek]

When jazz was "danceable", it was America's music. It was hugely popular across all across
america......Do you have any comments??

Doug, your asking my opinion about the demise of jazz record sales? Actually it is a very simple formula. Dancers buy
records. This has been true for any American pop music. The dancers lost interest in going to see live bands after
WWII; for a variety of cultural reasons. The next generation of dancers wanted something different. The infectious
rhythms of R&B and then into rock and roll were the in thing.

Without doing much research on record buying music trends, I would guess there is a definate change in taste every 10-15
years. As an older generation matures, priorites change and the music of their youth is not translated to the younger
generation. This seems to be the way the American pop music culture has evolved over the last 80 years.

The bigger question (and this is WAY off topic), can big band swing music ever have the dominate pop status like it did
between 1935 and 1945? The answer to me is clearly no. The music that the pop dancers want has to be a reflextion of
their taste and generation.

I will say this, and I have lectured this to some jazz history classes, I feel the next popular wave of jazz will be a
highly integrated fusion of more latin (especially Puerto Rico influenced salsa) and jazz. With the ever increasing
latin population in American and the love that culture has of horns and infectious salsa/merengue dance rhythms, it
becomes a natural extension for jazz horn players to play more latin jazz music.

Jerry: I think that you may have missed the point made earlier that many of the dancers, and especailly the DJs
on this forum, have _very_ broad musical tastes when it comes to listening.

That I have never questioned. You hit upon my thoughts below:

Much of the discussion on this board is influenced by: What can one most enjoyably dance to?

This is my point, the swing style is much broader than the taste of the current generation of swing dancers. Thus the
narrow appeal of just swing dance music is limiting. As evidence by the musical clips I placed on the web page
(especially the Harry James clips), the general consensus of the posted messages was the music really was not good for
the current dancers. Yet the music is clearly swing and even was appealing to an older generation of swing dancers.

The board name is 'Swing DJs'. The evolution of the board discussions has naturally evolved into discussions of swing
dance DJ'g. Swing dancing by the younger generation is a definate force upon the swing music scene. I don't doubt that
at all. I get frustrated by the narrow definition of swing music as it applies to the current generation of swing
dancers. That is my point.

So I strongly urge you to learn to dance and to understand first hand the drive and visceral feeling of the
dance music.

I really appreciate the effort to get me on the dance floor. My enjoyment is much more based in listening rather than
dancing. I generally go out maybe 2 or 3 nights a week to listen to live jazz in some form or another. One of my
nights is taken up with the radio station. That leaves me 3 or 4 nights a week to fill in with family, home
cleaning/laundry or just vegging out at home. The desire to dance is so low that I don't forsee learning how to dance
as being significant enough to replace my live listening evenings out.

All Bal Weekend is happening in early June right there in Cleveland. The beginner track will take you from walker to
dancer in just 9 short(!) hours of instruction with one of the worlds best instructors (Sylvia Sykes). Show up and
learn.

I'm planning on coming to the Saturday June 12th night right now. The Boilermakers from Pitts. will be playing live at
the Bohemian Hall. This is a gorgeous, turn of the century, ethnic community hall that has been renovated. My father
used to perform in community plays and just hang out at the hall back in the 1930s. I'm really looking forward to
hearing the Boilermakers live. I just heard some samples from the group online and really enjoyed it.

I'll be there both dancing and spinning. See ya there??

I hope so. If you have some free time during the weekend, let me know and we can get together for lunch/dinner at
someplace around town. I'm certain I can round up some swing friends around town to join us also.

Again Doug thanks for the dialog.

[mark0tz]

What is Balboa music?

Wow, our polar opposite is probably the techno-types:

Abstract Beats, Abstract Drum-n-Bass, Abstract Electronica, Abstract Hip-Hop, Abstract Hypnotic Pop, Acid House, Acid Jazz, Acid Rave, Acid-Beats, Acid-Funk, Acid-Techno, Alchemic House, Ambient Dance, Ambient Drum-n-Bass, Ambient Dub, Ambient Electronica, Ambient House, Ambient Jungle, Ambient Jungle Jazz, Ambient Noise Dub, Ambient Techno, Ambient Trance, Ambient-Electronica, Ambient-Industrial, Amyl House, Analogue Electro-Funk, Aquatic Techno-Funk, Aquatic-House, Atomic Breaks, Avant-Techno, Bass, Big Beat, Bleep-n-Bass, Blunted Beats, Breakbeat, Chemical Beats, Chicago Garage, Chicago House, Chill-Out, Chill-Out Electronica, Chill-Out House, Club-Dub, Coldwave, Cosmic Dance, Cyber Hardcore, Cybertech, Dark Ambient, Dark Drum-n-Bass, Dark Dub, Dark Techno, Dark Techstep, Darkcore, Darkstep, Darkwave, Deep House, Deep-Techno, Deep-Trance, Detroit Techno, Digi-Jazz, Digital, Digital Dub, Digital Hardcore, Dirty-House, Disco, Downtempo, Downtempo Funk, Downtempo Future Jazz, Drill-n-Bass, Dronecore, Drum-n-Bass Dub, Dub-Funk, Dub-Hop, Dub-n-Bass, Electro, Electro-Acoustic, Electro-Breaks, Electro-Dub, Electro-Techno, Electro-IDM Crossover, Electronic Mood-Music, Electronica, Ethno-Ambient, Ethnodelic Dub, Ethnodelia, Ethno-Techno, Euro-Dance, Euro-House, Euro-Techno, Euro-Trance, Exploratory Techno, Fourth World, Freestyle, Fungle, Funkadelica, Funky Bass, Funky Breaks, Future Breakbeat, Future Jazz, Futuristic Breakbeat, Futuristic Hardbeats, Futuristic Hardstep, Gabber, Garage, Global House, Global Trance, Goa-Trance, Gospel House, Goth-Hop, Happy Hardcore, Hardcore Techno, Hard Chill Ambient, Hard Electronic Funk, Hardcore, Hardcore Minimal Techno, Hardcore Techstep, Hard-House, Hard-Step, Hard-Techno, Hi NRG, Hip-House, House, Hyper-Funk, Hypnotic Breaks, Illbient, Ill-Dub, Industrial, Industrial-Metal, Instrumental Hip-Hop, Intelligent Drum-n-Bass, Intelligent Jungle, Intelligent Techno, Isolationism, Jazz-Hop, Jazz-Tech, Jazz-Techno, Jazzy Jungle, Jungle-Metal, Loungecore, Low End Breaks Miami Bass, Minimal Techno, Minimal Trance, Morphing, Mutant Techno, Mutated Minimal Techno, Mystic-Step, Neurofunk, Noir-House, Nu-Dark Jungle, Old School, Organic Chill-Out, Organic Electro, Organic Electronica, Organic House, Organic Techno, Post-Funk, Post-Industrial, Post-Rave, Prog-House, Progressive, Progressive House, Progressive Low Frequency, Progressive Trance, Ragga, Ragga-Jungle, Rave, Sci-Fi Jungle, Space Bass, Speed Garage, Subterranean, Suburban Bass, Swag, Tech-House, Techno, Techno Jungle, Techno-Dub, Techno-Funk, Techstep, Techxotica, Trance, Trancecore, Trance-Dub, Tribal, Tribal Beats, Tribal House, Tribal Soul, Trip-Hop, Tripno, Twilight Electronica, Two-Step, UK Acid, UK Breakbeat, Underground, World-Dance

[Mr Awesomer]

I can roll all those up into one category: shit.

[Doug]

Except that Balboa music is only a subset of the swing danceable music that most of djs on this list spin.

First, to pass up what is in my opinion the best opportunity to learn a swing dance - any swing dance - when it is right in your own back yard is silly. The fact that there is an entire 9 class progression for beginners taught by Sylvia Sykes is a very special opportunity in the world of swing.

[rant="Balboa music"] Second, I think that there is no such thing as "Balboa music", unless you simply mean 165 BPM and up Lindy Hop music. And a lot of way down tempo music works well also, either directly or by double-timing it ala NC2S. And don't tell me that what you will hear at a groove party is not a subset of the swing danceable music out there. When spinning for the bal dancers I have the opportunity to, and do, play some western swing (Smokey Wood & His Wood Chips, Modern Mountaineers...), bebop (yup - Charlie Parker, Sonny Stitt, etc.), US3asf's version of Canteloop, Fletcher Henderson, and various other jazz pieces and styles that the down tempo and groove dancers just won't tolerate.[/rant]

[Mr Awesomer]

I played sub 165 bpm music for the Balboa contest... right around 130 I think. Sylvia said she and Maxie used to eat up tempos slower then that.

[Doug]

And I thought that was excellent and appropriate! You notice that I did add "... way down tempo music works well also ..."

[djstarr]

I'm really looking forward to
hearing the Boilermakers live. I just heard some samples from the group online and really enjoyed it.

You will really enjoy this - I had a great time dancing to them at the Washington DC Exchange. And their latest CD, Give Me Your Telephone Number, is great for both listening and dancing - I've already played several tracks off of the CD the past couple times I've dj'ed and they've gone over very well.

[GemZombie]

Except that Balboa music is only a subset of the swing danceable music that most of djs on this list spin.

What is Balboa music?

Music that makes you wanna balboa? Hasn't this all been done to death. If suddenly the song changes and makes me wanna dance different... i might start doing some balboa. There is no "balboa music", just music that makes you dance.

...

for me at least.

[Doug]

Jerry - I couldn't let your comments about our collective prefered audio fidelity pass unanswered. It was almost as though you were implying that it was the lo-fidelity of the recordings that created the sound that we like to dance to, and that hifi recordings would be viewed as undanceable. So I figured that turnabout is fair play.

I too have uploaded some clips for comment. The clips ignore the fact that there is a HUGE range of swing music played by the DJs on this board and focus instead only on what might be termed Big Band sound. No Sarah Vaughn, no Bebop singers, nothing groove, etc., etc.. I also omit trios and very small group swing. This also DOES NOT attempt to represent a set - too much the same. And I cheated a little, or maybe a lot.

The 10 mp3 files are at: http://www.swingfusion.com/music Comments are solicited. Note that 01.mp3 is the bonus track. But please; I know that _many_ of you dance DJs will recognize many/most/all of the samples that I have included, so please no comments regarding the group/orchestra that is performing.

Jerry, this is especially for you. Oh, and all of these are in my DJ play list and a couple I use quite regularly, although I must admit that there are classic versions of most of these that I do prefer despite the lower fidelity. It has something to do with the musicians i think . But we are talking sound quality, right?

[Jerry_Jelinek]

Jerry - I couldn't let your comments about our collective prefered audio fidelity pass unanswered.....Jerry, this is especially for you.

Doug, I'm REALLY excited about listening. Give me a few days.

The 25th annual Tri-C jazz fest is in mid stream here in Cleveland. I'll be busy Tues., Wed. and Friday nights with concerts. I'm hoping to get to the clips on Thursday night or this weekend.

Prior to listening, thanks for taking the time to showcase some music. I'm anxious to dig into it!!!

Jerry

[GemZombie]

... 10 clips ...

Hope that "solicited" comment referred to everyone, not just Jerry. Assuming so, here's my comments:

1. Cymbals aren't mixed well. I prefer Andy Kirk's version of Froggy bottom
2. I like <edited>. I think the band does good re-creation work. I play this song on a regular basis.
3. Haven't heard this one before. I like it. Little heavy on the jazz side for dancing, and not lots of energy, but I'd probably play it when the mood is right.
4. Something about this one I don't quite like, can't put my finger on it though.
5. <edited> rules! Good re-creations of Benny Goodman Combo work here with nice Charlie Christian style guitar work.
6. Not sure who this is, but I bet this band is awesome live, they have the energy.
7. I like this one too. Not over mixed. I love it when bands really do understand how it's supposed to sound.
8. <edited> rules too! Notice the underuse of studio gadgets and effects. This means a lot to me. This band knows how to recreate the sound.
9. Reverb. *sigh* Boring tune too. Not my thing.
10. I'm not a trombone fan, though the band does a pretty good job here.

Best clip selection so far

[julius]

But please; I know that _many_ of you dance DJs will recognize many/most/all of the samples that I have included, so please no comments regarding the group/orchestra that is performing.

JESSE IS A SKIMMER!

[Lawrence]

I make no pretense about my ability to dance. I've been asked several
times by the swing dancers/promoters/instructors around town about
joining in on the fun. I really don't have any desire to do so.

This one clarification explains so much as to why nobody seems to see eye-to-eye with your perspective, Jerry. It might be more productive for you to recognize that fact and try to understand how the Lindy-focus LEGITIMATELY colors everyone's perspective on this board instead of try to change it. You are perhaps picking the most futile battle of them all, here.

[Doug]

... 10 clips ...

Hope that "solicited" comment referred to everyone, not just Jerry.

Yup. Solicited refers to everyone! But there were rules! You have to obey the rules !

[julius]

I make no pretense about my ability to dance. I've been asked several
times by the swing dancers/promoters/instructors around town about
joining in on the fun. I really don't have any desire to do so.

This one clarification explains so much as to why nobody seems to see eye-to-eye with your perspective, Jerry. It might be more productive for you to recognize that fact and try to understand how the Lindy-focus LEGITIMATELY colors everyone's perspective on this board instead of try to change it. You are perhaps picking the most futile battle of them all, here.

Yeah, far be it from us to see his point of view. Make him see ours instead. You go, Lawrence. Tell him like it is!

I think you could have phrased your sentiment a little less rudely.