They sure have...they came either from west coast swing or the modern swing era...and have taken it in their own directions. But also , as great as they are, none have honestly studied the academic aspects of history to the depth only a few historians have, which is understandable because of the fact they would not of had the chance to become such great dancers if they would have spent all their time studying history.JesseMiner wrote:These dancers are all passionate about the Lindy Hop but have obviously taken it in different directions.
The dance became more relaxed and laid-back, but it still retained an intense swinging feeling reflecting the raw essense of Lindy Hop.
When you say Laid back? to what are you refering or what years and footage?
In some cases during the 1950's it did retain an essence related to the Lindy Hop...however depending on the year your talking about it , it simply wasn't called Lindy Hop by the normal population of dancers. Not by the Savoy Dancers, not by the LA dancers not by any of these dancers.
Ofcource dancers Like Al Minns continued dancing the Lindy Hop, and upon arriving and dancing along side younger dancers he used the phrase The Lindy Hop, and although these younger dancers appeared to be doing a simular dance to the same music, they used a different term, most commonly "swing" . I guess we could get into this more in person to explain specifics...
I guess I understand that your coming from a person that has been influenced primary modern dancers and Musicians? and that who have built yourself up to beleive in what they beleive. I'm not sure, but thats kinda how it reads.JesseMiner wrote: If you understand where I'm coming from, then you can understand why it is slightly insulting and offensive being constantly told that the dance I am passionate about is not Lindy Hop and the music I am incredibly passionate about is not suited for Lindy Hop.
Until recently, there has been no critical aclaim said on the internet because of the fact that this new style of dancing wasn;t as big and had yet grown away from it's original form. but now it is evident by a growing amount of dancers this new style is only getting larger < which is cool if I might add> and the fact they want to continue using the term Lindy Hop can only last so long the further and further it grows into this new and fun form of dance.
at the same time I find it insulting that a few modern social dancers that have only dance a couple years want to reach back into history and pull out a label once used and so ignorantly apply it to what they do.
I'm not saying the intire scene of social dancing today, but it has been growing more and more away from it's original form. where to draw the line? in clearly in the grey area of now by a majority depending on the region,event or place.
I don't want to evolution to stop, I want to see it grow more then ever, I welcome more types of music more styles of dance, as I will be enjoying them all. But I can't see the continued use of dance terms from the 20's or 30's being any benifit to documenting our history when there is hardly any resemblence.
I never siad it didn;t swing, nor did I say some of the music cannot be Lindy Hopper too, I did say the majority of it makes me do what I would call "swing dancing" meaning it's a combination of all eras of dance put together into one, primarily based off Improvision.JesseMiner wrote: Barbara Morrison's music SCREAMS Lindy Hop to me, making my entire body want to swing hard.
others? how about ours?JesseMiner wrote: I can continue to understand and appreciate more about others' cultural histories,
devalue? why would you say devalue? and what is mine? this is the american history of vernacular dance, I'm passionate about preserving our history so that we may pass it along into the future for generations to come. The fact that some people want to ignore our history to glorify their social dancing is not only ignorant but selfish and a disservice to our history. I'm also passionate about dancing and have an understanding of the the fact that there are in fact grey area's, grey area's I will always respect until it gets pushed into another realm.JesseMiner wrote: but please don't ask me to give up or devalue mine just because you are passionate about yours
As a social dancer these area's are much broader and terms are used very loosely, as an academic the terms are specific with an understanding to those that want to document OUR history , so that the future will have a grasp of our growth.
well thats refreshing, but unfortunatly many people do use the term that way, and those are the people I wish to educate. Posting and talking about it is only one way to get people to know, and understand that there is a specific dance called Lindy Hop, that came from Harlem USA. In person ofcourse is the best way, where I am able to share sources , as in interveiws by those that acually lived and danced through these era's and as well as film footage of the dancing it's self. I would start by directing people to view Margret BAtiuchok's interview of George Llyod (Savoy Ballroom dancer and Harvest Moon Ball winner) which she has availible for sale. where he defines more clearly the difference between the Lindy Hop of those like Frank Manning and the swing dancing he amd his generation does, which followed Frankies generation.JesseMiner wrote: I'm not trying to claim that everything under the sun in Lindy Hop,
I realy do not invent terms and lables, I just share the information that I have uncovered and share it to all that I can so that they can understand our history and how it became to be.
I haven't relabled anyones dance, other then it's all just Swing, BARBARA was the one thats has been calling the crowd Lindy Groovers....and I sorta agree that it's fitting.JesseMiner wrote: but I think most of us in this discussion have a lot more in common than we care to admit.