SwingDJs

I am part of a group of people that is trying to shape a CD of a big band that plays Bennie Goodman material and new material in Bennie Goodman style. One of the questions that came up was which recording technique should be used. I know there was already a thread on recording techniques called "New Big Bands Recordings vs. Original Recordings", but this thread does not answer what we as dancers and DJs like best. Personally I do not really care, but maybe there are people out there who do have a strong preference. Should we use one microphone and record the whole band in one go, or should we record all sections separate. Should we use old microphones,... Any ideas are welcome. The main criteria is that the CD should appeal to dancers. What do swing DJs recommend?

Personally I think either method is okay as long as the balance of the instruments is right. Sometimes the drums can be too overpowering or the guitar lost in the background, for example.

Jonathon Stout would be the guy to speak to...

You may also want to check with Dean Mora or with someone from the Bratislava Hot Serenaders.

Trevor and Alex, thanks for the suggestions. However I am more interested in your opinions as DJ's than in the opinion of the band leaders you refer to (although I would not mind them chiming in). The people that I work with know a lot about recording technique, but they do not know what appeals most to us DJ's and dancers. Like I said, I personally do not care as much as long as the song swings and this band swings hard, so I can not advice them which way to go. Maybe you can. Do you like the vintage sound or do you like the crisp studio recordings of modern bands? I really value any input from you DJs. If you put on a record of a contemporary band, do you ever think, well this is nice but it would have been much better if they used vintage microphones or had done a live recording or .....

While I appreciate the desire to "keep things real" by using the old recording techniques, quite frankly I would much rather have a band record using modern methods. That said though, it really doesn't matter much when it comes time to DJ... since no one records a band in such a way so as to ensure it sounds best played over the crappy PA system at your local dance studio (nor should they.)

In that case, I think I'm with you on this one, Robert: I don't personally care that much. (Or perhaps it's more accurate to say I don't know enough about it to care, which is another way of saying it doesn't make enough of a difference to me for me to have noticed and invested time in learning more about it...in short: whatev.)

Just keep the songs short and the rhythm section strong and I'll be happy.

lipi wrote: Just keep the songs short and the rhythm section strong and I'll be happy.

Agreed! As a DJ this is by far more important than the recording technique. I would focus on which environment is likely to produce the best playing. Often studio recordings, with everyone recording their parts separately sound more stilted than a "live" recording where everyone is more relaxed.

trev wrote:I would focus on which environment is likely to produce the best playing. Often studio recordings, with everyone recording their parts separately sound more stilted than a "live" recording where everyone is more relaxed.

Amen to that.

But really, are any jazz musicians recording their parts separately these days? It might have happened in the 1980s, when focus sometimes tended to be on technical perfection rather than an organic ensemble feel, but surely those ideals are long gone? One can hope.

Nope, it still happens today. One of our local bands just finished recording a new album that way. I was a bit disappointed when I found out.

Robert Cullen wrote:I am part of a group of people that is trying to shape a CD of a big band that plays Bennie Goodman material

Robert - which Benny Goodman songs you are planning to record?

trev wrote: Agreed! As a DJ this is by far more important than the recording technique. I would focus on which environment is likely to produce the best playing. Often studio recordings, with everyone recording their parts separately sound more stilted than a "live" recording where everyone is more relaxed.

Fully agree.

Is this going to be a similar line-up to the one that played at ALX last year? Exciting news, if so. Can't wait to hear what you come up with!

Hi Andy, yes the recording will be done by the band that played at the most recent Amsterdam Lindy Exchange (and yes, in a similar line up). The good news is that they will also play at the coming Amsterdam Lindy Exchange (first weekend of July). Unfortunately you will not be able to pick up the album there since the planning is to record it in the studion that same weekend. Having both activities -- playing live at ALX and recording in the studio -- in the same weekend should without a doubt lead to a great performance. As you can imagine I am really looking forward to this weekend. Hope to see you there.

Robert Cullen wrote:I am part of a group of people that is trying to shape a CD of a big band that plays Bennie Goodman material and new material in Bennie Goodman style. One of the questions that came up was which recording technique should be used ... Any ideas are welcome. The main criteria is that the CD should appeal to dancers. What do swing DJs recommend?

It would be useful to have one or two examples of the Benny Goodman tracks you are going to record. In my opinion, the majority of modern big band swing CDs come nowhere near matching the feel or sound of the orginal bands of the 1930s and 1940s like Benny Goodman and Glenn Miller. However this means if you can produce something good, it will really stand out . I agree with the others that the playing is vital. When many modern bands play swing music, the rhythm sections don't really cut it, and the horn section playing (which was I think a big part of late 30s Goodman records) is too loose, and the result is it doen't have swinging energy. It's the tight rhythmic stabs of rhythm from the brass sections that really make a lot of swing era records 'hot'. Swingtime In The Rockies, Roll 'Em, The Kingdom of Swing, Sing Me A Swing Song, Sing Sing Sing, Sugar Foot Stomp and Down South Camp Meeting are examples of hot swinging Goodman tracks from the late 1930s.

As far as recording techniques go (which was actually your question), I think records from the swing era have a warmth that suits the music. Perhaps being mono helps. This is only a hunch, but 've got an idea that if you use too many microphones to capture the sound of the individual instruments, you will gain detail but lose rhythmic swing feel. I think if you are recording swing music, then that rhythmic feel is everything. In other words, it's more important to feel the excitement of the rhythm than to hear the individual instruments.

If you have access to a regular swing club, you could actually try recording a particular track with different recording techniques, and then play different versions at the club and see how they come over, and ask the opinion of some friendly dancers or DJs there.

It would be great to know when you have recorded the CD, and I'm sure quite a few people here would be interested in buying a copy

Hi Haydn, thanks for your elaborate answer. We are still working on the list of songs to be recorded, but the bulk will be for certain songs from the second half of the thirties. It is very likely that songs like Swingtime in the Rockies, Downsouth Camp Meeting and Roll'em will make it to the CD. Also lower tempo songs like He ain't got rhythm and Blue skies are good candidates for the CD.

Haydn wrote:It would be useful to have one or two examples of the Benny Goodman tracks you are going to record. In my opinion, the majority of modern big band swing CDs come nowhere near matching the feel or sound of the orginal bands of the 1930s and 1940s like Benny Goodman and Glenn Miller. However this means if you can produce something good, it will really stand out .

Have you seen these guys? If not, get yourself to ALX this year (alas - I don't think we can make it this time around)

I was completely blown away by them last year - this woefully short clip should give you some idea of what they're like in action.