More Live Echoes of the Swinging Bands by The Big 18

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Haydn · #1 Post by **Haydn** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:38 pm

Some copies of this sought-after CD are currently available on various Amazon country sites:

http://www.amazon.com/More-Live-Echoes- ... 245&sr=1-1

Audio samples are available on Amazon Germany:

http://www.amazon.de/More-Live-Echoes-S ... 539&sr=1-3

The first CD, Live Echoes of the Swinging Bands is also available, at a higher price.

anton · #2 Post by **anton** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 7:50 am

Those albums are now 50 years old, so anyone in Europe who owns the original LPs can legally dub them and put them up for free download on the web. Who will do it?

Toon Town Dave · #3 Post by **Toon Town Dave** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:24 am

I bought both LPs on-line from a seller in Germany a couple years ago. A local dancer had the gear and was kind enough to digitize them for me recently. I like them, I definitely recommend both albums, even better if you can get them on CD.

alainw · #4 Post by **alainw** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 9:13 pm

Haydn, thank you for posting this! I finally bought a copy

Alain

Eyeball · #5 Post by **Eyeball** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 1:34 am

How good is this, really?

It just seems like a lot of vintage Jazz men who were doing studio work in NYC got together for a recreation.

Is there something that makes this one better than so many others of its kind?

CafeSavoy · #6 Post by **CafeSavoy** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 2:21 pm

Eyeball wrote:How good is this, really?

It just seems like a lot of vintage Jazz men who were doing studio work in NYC got together for a recreation.

Is there something that makes this one better than so many others of its kind?

What are some good examples of the others? One I know of is the Fletcher Henderson Reunion Band which is pretty good.
The George Williams tribute to Lunceford on the other hand was only so-so. Although the album art ain't bad.

Eyeball · #7 Post by **Eyeball** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:18 pm

Eyeball wrote:How good is this, really?

Anyone have praise or non-praise for it?

lipi · #8 Post by **lipi** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 7:20 pm

Eyeball wrote:
Eyeball wrote:How good is this, really?
Anyone have praise or non-praise for it?

i quite like both records. i have the fletcher henderson all stars "big reunion" album, and i greatly prefer the big 18 ones for dj'ing: the songs are shorter and the tempos are more in line with what people here like. i don't think i have heard any of the others of its kind that you refer to. examples greatly appreciated.

both albums have some good mid tempo (by my random definition: 140-180) tunes for lindy hop. "easy does it", "celery stalks at midnight", "organ grinder's swing", and "march of the toys" are my favourite tracks. i don't play them often, though, because some people like to groan when they hear "celery", for instance.

i don't care much for their recording of "summit ridge drive". shaw's 1940 one is just perfect.

fredo · #9 Post by **fredo** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:11 pm

I bought both, and while I appreciate having them and listening to them occasionally at home, I just don't wind up DJing anything from them. It's a combination of a few cheesy intros, a general lack of energy, a constant symbol in my ear, some solid playing, but just not enough to make me think about them when I'm DJing.

The best track on either CD, in my opinion, is Swingtime In the Rockies -- they just sound most comfortable and much more into it on that track.

Other decent tracks include:

-- Easy Does It
-- Blues on Parade
-- Summit Ridge Drive
-- Parade of the Milk Bottle Caps
-- etc.

The more I list and listen to them the less I feel I could call one better than another, and not in a "they're all great" kinda way, more in a "meh" kinda way. While I appreciate that this is a recreation band in the late 50s trying to keep it alive, I think in all cases I'd take the original recording over any of these given a choice. And I think that could be true for dancers, DJs, and likely the musicians that recorded it. It was probably fun for them to record this at that time, but likely because of 20 years of nostalgia of their earlier bands. But it's great that they did record it, and that people could still hear swinging music at the time.

I did especially like the trombone line up of all-stars; Lawrence Brown, Vic Dickenson, Dicky Wells -- but i'm biased.

Eyeball · #10 Post by **Eyeball** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:42 pm

lipi wrote:examples greatly appreciated.

Thx. I have the Henderson, but have not played it in years.

To clarify - are we talking about all the genres this topic might cover, like old alumni getting together, older leaders doing recreations, tribute albums, etc?

The one that Van Alexander did were pretty decent. "The Home of Happy Feet". Whoa - he did a 2nd one. Never heard of it til now.
https://www.rillen.dk/index.asp?headGro ... ctNr=93947

Sy Oliver did a Jimmie Lunceford reunion/tribute on Decca in hi-fi, then Billy May did one for Capitol in stereo.
http://nolodespreciespornoserunlossless ... y-his.html

Another Sy Oliver - part of the Lunceford, looks like, plus other SO charts - never heard of it- http://www.amazon.fr/Sycholoswing-Sy-Ol ... l_1#disc_1

There are all the Glen Gray records on Capitol.

The Billy May recreations done for Time/Life.

Jerry Gray did a Miller one and maybe more.

I even have one by Vince Giordano and the Night Hawks doing all Glenn Miller tunes. Limited release LP.

Enoch Light did 2 or 3 or more on his Project Three label in stereo.
http://www.enochlight.com/~enochlig/ima ... Pr5049.jpg
http://www.enochlight.com/~enochlig/ima ... Pr5056.jpg

Ted Heath the British bloke did a few like 'SWING IS KING" and same but Volume 2

There's the George Williams one on RCA, but he did 2 others, too.
http://www.amazon.com/Swing-Classics-St ... 714&sr=1-1
plus this - never heard of it
http://www.mp3.com/albums/122032/summar ... clk=artalb

And lots of the original leaders were re-recording their stuff in Hi-Fi and then stereo

And there were a whole bunch of cheaply done LPs on the Bright Orange label that used original members of the bands to do tribute albums to various leaders.

Also - when hi-fi came in, there was a big rush to get the old arrangements done again. Albums were being issued like wild fire and sometimes I got the impression was not to make good music, but to make some money.

I don't know of anyone who has every done a history/review of all these types of recordings. They varied wildly in quality and even content with 'ringer' songs that the leaders had never been associated with turning up on the tribute albums.

I think the only series of albums that had a steady and good consistency to them were the Grays and the Mays - downside - as someone pointed out - even though they are playing their original charts almost note for note, all the recordings sound like they are being played by the same band - which is pretty true.

Anyway - you have to go into these things with an attitude that does not require them to be the best things you ever heard b/c they rarely are. You guys need them for dancer's purposes, but some of these may not work for dancers, but sound pretty good for listeners - the soloist that nails a solo done 40 years early and maybe by himself, or a band that gets the energy and spirit right or some section work that is spot on to the original recording....blah blah blah.

Eyeball · #11 Post by **Eyeball** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 11:25 pm

Here's three more by the Swing Masters - featuring Ricky Tickee on drums on some of the BG tracks, I hear.

http://www.amazon.com/Vol-1-Happy-Birth ... pd_sim_m_2

http://www.amazon.com/Vol-2-Benny-King- ... B001GZ6Q2E

http://www.amazon.com/Vol-3-Gene-Krupa- ... y_m_text_c

I listened to quite a few of these samples. What is the point can anyone tell me of these recordings?

Also seems like they ran out of Krupa associated titles and slammed on some non Krupa material. Weird.

lipi · #12 Post by **lipi** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 11:49 pm

thanks, john.

i've had the van alexander two-fer on my wishlist for a while, but it's never dropped below $50. i'll check some of the others out.

Eyeball · #13 Post by **Eyeball** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 1:01 am

lipi wrote:thanks, john.

i've had the van alexander two-fer on my wishlist for a while, but it's never dropped below $50. i'll check some of the others out.

U bet.

rule of thumb - all these types of things have compromises in them somewhere. In the 50s and 60s, they didn't want them to sound old fashioned, they would add 'hi-fi' instruments like flutes and cymbals and triangles or they would update intos or change harmonies. In the early stereo age they wanted separation into 2 channels, so balances would be thrown off from what you might remember on the original discs. In the 70s and right now, too many original guys were dead and the newer guys didnt understand the nuances of the originals and/or sleep-walked through them.

I just hope for the best or a decent compromise - like hearing the parts as written in clear hi-fi stereo sound even if they don't get played with the same vigor and enthusiasm and raison d'être.

And sometimes it's nice to hear old section mates playing together again.

Haydn · #14 Post by **Haydn** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 4:59 am

Eyeball wrote:There are all the Glen Gray records on Capitol.

I like these too, original arrangements, great sound. and they have some energy.

Casa Loma in Hi-Fi!
http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=am ... ftxq8gldde

Swinging Sounds of Great Bands
http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=am ... ftxqtkldae

More Sounds of the Great Swing Bands
http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=am ... frxqwaldae

For some reason, they are called 'Big Band Sounds' on the iTunes Store

Eyeball · #15 Post by **Eyeball** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 5:18 am

CafeSavoy wrote:

I never realized that "Warm Valley" was a Lunceford tune.