The limitations of partner dance?

[Haydn]

It seems to be assumed that you need to dance with a partner to dance to the music of the Swing Era (say 1935 - 1945). So does this limit the swing dance scene?

What do you think?

[kitkat]

I wouldn't say that's true!!!!! However, if you're not a Dawn Hampton-level genius improvisor, it helps to know a lot of steps that don't make up any particular dance.

I don't want to name them all, but they're the kinds of steps that you see in the Big Apple, the Jitterbug Stroll, Frankie Manning's Shim Sham, etc.

Break those dances apart into its component movements and you have things that you can repeat & re-string together as you hear fit with the music.

Plus, most of them are very swingey, rather than Charlestoney.


I think you see swing dancers solo dancing to Charlestoney music more often than to swing-era music

1. because the basic Charleston step is the only thing they're comfortable falling back on between brainstorms about what to do and
2. because the basic Charleston step doesn't work nearly as well for swing-era music as it does for earlier music / hot club music (you were correct to observe that).

But if you were to go to a place with

1. dancers who were more comfortable looking like fools while making up some sort of basic to return to while thinking,
2. or who were good at not looking like fools while making up some sort of basic to return to while thinking (like Dawn Hampton),
3. or dancers who simply knew 40 steps,

I think you'd see solo jams to swing-era music.

[Mr Awesomer]

That's the silliest, and most uneducated, assumption I've heard in a while.

[kitkat]

His, or the assumptions I've made about factors that would lead him to make that assumption?

[JesseMiner]

It seems to be assumed that you need to dance with a partner to dance to the music of Swing Era (say 1935 - 1945). So does this limit the swing dance scene?

What do you think?

Partner dancing is one of the main selling points of swing dancing that makes it special and appealing! I don't see that as limiting at all.

Jesse

[Mr Awesomer]

His, or the assumptions I've made about factors that would lead him to make that assumption?

His (or whomever he was referred to) of course. You shouldn't have even needed to second guess that, haha.

[lipi]

It seems to be assumed that you need to dance with a partner to dance to the music of Swing Era (say 1935 - 1945). So does this limit the swing dance scene?

What do you think?

tap.

[flyingcamel]

I think the dancing solo to swing music "scene" is huge but you have no way of measuring it because people don't get together do it. I'm gonna go do some right now in fact. To Clark Terry and Oscar Peterson. Sometimes I don't dance the whole songs, only the sections I really like. Oops, that's not swing era. Nevermind.

[Haydn]

Partner dancing is one of the main selling points of swing dancing that makes it special and appealing! I don't see that as limiting at all.

A selling point - yes, but also a limiting factor, as you have to learn to partner dance first. In this sense, it belongs with ballroom rather than hip-hop or house.

[Swifty]

Partner dancing is one of the main selling points of swing dancing that makes it special and appealing! I don't see that as limiting at all.

A selling point - yes, but also a limiting factor, as you have to learn to partner dance first. In this sense, it belongs with ballroom rather than hip-hop or house.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJsBa2u9aMQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjSLzlEhnC0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKKW3oDIFGY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIMqP5F-j8o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hozrkFHxoQ4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LAo6vaBEyk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nipAHbpEMx4

[Mr Awesomer]

Partner dancing is one of the main selling points of swing dancing that makes it special and appealing! I don't see that as limiting at all.

A selling point - yes, but also a limiting factor, as you have to learn to partner dance first. In this sense, it belongs with ballroom rather than hip-hop or house.

Are you suggesting that solo dancing doesn't require simular amounts of learning and practice?

[kitkat]

Are you suggesting that solo dancing doesn't require simular amounts of learning and practice?

I'd certainly argue that the fact that you generally hurt only yourself if you do it with minimal learning & practice leads to a lot of pressure in the name of "politeness" to make sure to learn something at early stages of partner dancing. I'd definitely believe that people don't feel as much pressure to learn or practice solo dancing in early stages of venturing into it.

[Haydn]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJsBa2u9aMQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjSLzlEhnC0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKKW3oDIFGY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIMqP5F-j8o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hozrkFHxoQ4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LAo6vaBEyk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nipAHbpEMx4

You posted some clips of people doing Jazz steps and routines. Al Minns and Leon James on some old TV shows, and two more recent clips - (I like the last one featuring, I think, Manu Smith). I love jazz routines, they are probably my favourite way to dance, and I like watching them. At a social dance, you will sometimes see people do unpartnered jazz dancing near the front. Occasionally, you see people dancing on their own. Then you have organised routines like a Shim Sham, which most people will usually join.

For the most part though, people go to a dance expecting to dance with a partner, which takes time to learn. Jazz steps also take time to learn properly as well, as they show in one of the clips you posted -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hozrkFHxoQ4

The ideal for me is to have a dance where the music and atmosphere is so compelling that people just get up and do whatever comes, whether it's clapping their hands, stomping their feet, doing a routine, or swinging out. The only time I've seen anything like this was one night at Herräng last year when virtually the whole room was on its' feet, and you couldn't tell who was dancing with who - it was a cross between a lindy dance and a hip-hop party. If you could create this sort of buzz at a regular club, people would flock to it. But at lindy dances, people tend to look around for a partner first, and dance second (if they can find a suitable partner, etiquette demands that they discard them after the second dance) - that's what I mean by the limitations of partner dance.

[kitkat]

But at lindy dances, people tend to look around for a partner first, and dance second (if they can find a suitable partner, etiquette demands that they discard them after the second dance) - that's what I mean by the limitations of partner dance.

That's because old swing music lovers who don't enjoy partner dancing dance (in that free-spirited, "move"less way you described) at home for FREE in their living rooms.

Old swing music lovers who can stand partner dancing might be convinced to get out and about and then do whatever the rest of the room is doing (partner dancing).

And the rest of the people in the room where old swing music is played in public are there because they love the feel of that particular partner dance (or because they love partner dancing in general and rather like old swing music the best among the musics partner dancing is traditionally done to) and will do it to whatever music is available.


You're just not gonna sell "leave the comfort of your pajamas, get gussied up, and come dance by yourself in the presence of other people!" to to a critical mass of people who love the music but don't want to partner dance.

[Eyeball]

The ideal for me is to have a dance where the music and atmosphere is so compelling that people just get up and do whatever comes, whether it's clapping their hands, stomping their feet, doing a routine, or swinging out.

The only time I've seen anything like this was one night at Herräng last year when virtually the whole room was on its' feet, and you couldn't tell who was dancing with who - it was a cross between a lindy dance and a hip-hop party.

If you could create this sort of buzz at a regular club, people would flock to it.

You're just not happy, are you?

Why would what you describe be "the ideal" for you or anyone?

The point of mounting a dance is to give people a place to dance.

If you just want to stamp your feet or clap or whatever short of actual dancing, you can go to a club and yell out, "yeah, man!", too.

I see more and more people in the swing scene expressing dissatisfaction with actual Swing music and with established Lindy and other Swing dances.

Are these people sure they are in the right scene?