Shelling out money for your personal collection and your personal enjoyment is one thing. DJing is a service - paid or unpaid - and if you're doing it for yourself, you're doing it for the wrong reasons.
(Not that you said that, but I'm illustrating here.)
I would never recommend buying music you hate. But staying within a genre and pursuing gigs at venues that are moving away from you isn't good for anyone. I am scheduled to play Sin City this year (I hope) and I guarantee that I've given my book some special consideration in advance. I would rather bow out than have a disatisfied crowd that paid money to be there.
Kalman
ECS/Lindy/WCS - Bridging the Gap
Moderators: Mr Awesomer, JesseMiner, CafeSavoy
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mousethief
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Greg Avakian
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I think the issue of compromise is a personal issue; you know there's no "absolute' answer. You have stated that you can't please everyone -which is true, but not a motto I want to live by, right? At most events there are a variety of people present, so it seems like a small effort to play a variety of music without compromising "too much".falty411 wrote:How much should you compromise? People are being "inspired to lindy hop" to music that gets farther and farther away from swing and sometimes not even jazz. Should you adjust your DJing to fit those needs too in your effort to keep everyone happy?JesseMiner wrote:Success (keeping dancers with varied tastes happy throughout the evening) in both of these situations seems to involve some level of compromise.
Jesse
Even more so, as a music enthusiast, doesn't it pain you to play music you dislike? Doesn't it hurt even more to shell out the $12 to buy music you don't like so you can have it to play at places where you try to keep dancers with varied tastes happy?
At ALHC, I played music that I'm not crazy about and got really nice compliments from the "fast/vintage" dancers. Nick told me I should have been spinning in the vintage room. So -for me- that kind of appreciation is worth way more than the "hurt" of buying some CDs that I won't play that much. Besides, having gone through the experience of buying a lot of music I wouldn't want to dance to, I learned something.
I really like being a DJ and I am always always always learning more about different kinds of music. I'm pigeon-holed less and lesss and I like that too. I like that process not just for the recognition, but also just to be learning more -and I like the current challenge of pleasing people I had a reputation for ignoring. hehehe.
Hmmm.
I'm not asserting that this should stay my motive, especially after reading what people have had to say about the function of a DJ here. But I'm wondering if it's an acceptable motive to DJ--is there only one purpose we can have, or can we have different reasons and methods as well as different tunes?
I started collecting music because as a beginner-intermediate lindy hopper, I'd only heard two people spin in the whole town. At the time, our main event's DJ always turned the controls over to Falty for the big band set--I had assumed that it was because he either didn't want to spin that stuff or he didn't have much of it. I thought when Falty left town, there was a chance that old stuff that made me want to dance might disappear from our scene. Ha! Actually, I'd say more and more people have been spinning it up here, and doing so well, including the event's DJ himself, so it's all good. But the reason I took an interest in it is to make sure that should there be a void, someone could fill it. *shrug* Silly newbie dreams--you think you can do everything as fast as you want to.
But I think that a part of me still has the same motivation. Maybe it should change. But right now, what makes me want to DJ is a desire to make a set of big band music as likeable and as motivational as possible for the floor...it's one thing to have a big band set--it's another thing to have a great one. I want to be the drug peddler with as good of crack as possible so when people try it for their first time, the chances they'll get hooked are even higher. I didn't like big band music until I heard it spun well--and I've got this feeling there are more people out there who just need exposure to well-done sets of it. That's why I chose to make a music collection within a certain genre and practice getting better and better at spinning from it.
What do you think? Is striving to make a type of music as pleasurable for the floor as possible a goal equally noble to "pleasing the floor?"
I'm not asserting that this should stay my motive, especially after reading what people have had to say about the function of a DJ here. But I'm wondering if it's an acceptable motive to DJ--is there only one purpose we can have, or can we have different reasons and methods as well as different tunes?
I started collecting music because as a beginner-intermediate lindy hopper, I'd only heard two people spin in the whole town. At the time, our main event's DJ always turned the controls over to Falty for the big band set--I had assumed that it was because he either didn't want to spin that stuff or he didn't have much of it. I thought when Falty left town, there was a chance that old stuff that made me want to dance might disappear from our scene. Ha! Actually, I'd say more and more people have been spinning it up here, and doing so well, including the event's DJ himself, so it's all good. But the reason I took an interest in it is to make sure that should there be a void, someone could fill it. *shrug* Silly newbie dreams--you think you can do everything as fast as you want to.
But I think that a part of me still has the same motivation. Maybe it should change. But right now, what makes me want to DJ is a desire to make a set of big band music as likeable and as motivational as possible for the floor...it's one thing to have a big band set--it's another thing to have a great one. I want to be the drug peddler with as good of crack as possible so when people try it for their first time, the chances they'll get hooked are even higher. I didn't like big band music until I heard it spun well--and I've got this feeling there are more people out there who just need exposure to well-done sets of it. That's why I chose to make a music collection within a certain genre and practice getting better and better at spinning from it.
What do you think? Is striving to make a type of music as pleasurable for the floor as possible a goal equally noble to "pleasing the floor?"
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mousethief
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Why the hell not? I think 9 out of 10 DJs agree, keep the dancers dancing.kitkat wrote: What do you think? Is striving to make a type of music as pleasurable for the floor as possible a goal equally noble to "pleasing the floor?"
Our disconnect is when we superimpose our DJ style over the event itself and all we can see is our style. That's not to say you cannot DJ within a genre or whatever but you have to pick your battles.
Me, I love old school Basie. Just straight KC stomp. And when I put together a classic set, I like to think of myself at the Savoy or the Hey Hey or The Famous Door. That's the pulse I would like to see on the floor.
There's no problem in the DJ asking for a given result on the floor, so long as it swings; demanding something is something else entirely.
But I wouldn't put together a classic set all the time, nor would I jackhammer into any venue. My best successes at spreading my passion for a particular piece has been to invite others to listen to it - in my car, in my home, at the booth, wherever. Often, that leads to a request for the piece and I have no problem playing it.
Kalman
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Greg Avakian
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Only if the DJ suceeds.kitkat wrote: What do you think? Is striving to make a type of music as pleasurable for the floor as possible a goal equally noble to "pleasing the floor?"
If everyone is dancing and asking the DJ what that awesome song that s/he just played was, then I'm all with the 'hell yes' answer. If a DJ is bombing, an "E for effort" still doesn't serve the dance floor since nobody else but the DJ is going to care about motive.***
I guess I would say that they are not equally noble, but in the hands of a knowedgable and attentive DJ they are definitely equally possible (which is what other people have already said).
The path I would recomend would be an agenda of pleasing the floor first -motivated by a desire to share the music you love, but not dependant on that being the only way.
I hope that makes sense...
*** Just want to underline one other thing:
Nobody gives a damn about what we are thinking when we are DJing (except maybe other DJs). If someone says "so and so bombed last night, they suck as a DJ". I don't think people are going to ask "well, were they trying to figure out what went wrong?" or "What songs did they play?" If someone else asks, the response will be "Well, Johnny said they suck" -not- "Well, Johnny said they suck because they are a Type A DJ playing in a Type B venue". EDIT: except maybe our friends...
What's worse is that whatever is said will probably be exagerated
I hope this is helpful, I'm not trying to be an ass.
I think
1) Know your audience
2) Know your book
3) Know what part of your book will relate to your audience
is pretty much what everyone is saying here.
I'm guessing the biggest debate is how much of your book should be music that you don't necessarily like and don't want to play, but that some dancers want to hear.
1) Know your audience
2) Know your book
3) Know what part of your book will relate to your audience
is pretty much what everyone is saying here.
I'm guessing the biggest debate is how much of your book should be music that you don't necessarily like and don't want to play, but that some dancers want to hear.
nonejulius wrote:I'm guessing the biggest debate is how much of your book should be music that you don't necessarily like and don't want to play, but that some dancers want to hear.
unless you are a wedding DJ
hahah
-mikey faltesek
"Dancing is the union of the body with the rhythm and the sound of the music." Al Minns in 1984
"Dancing is the union of the body with the rhythm and the sound of the music." Al Minns in 1984
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Greg Avakian
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Well said Julius.
I'd say the percentage of your book depends a lot on the size of your book. If you're DJing with 50 original CDs, then maybe zero. If you have 200+ CDs and many of them are mixes, then you can afford more stuff you don't like.
Burning mixes means you can take 20-30 Basie albums and turn them into 4-5 CDs you really like. Or maybe 20-30 neo swing CDs and turn them into 1 CD you're willing to carry...
I'd say the percentage of your book depends a lot on the size of your book. If you're DJing with 50 original CDs, then maybe zero. If you have 200+ CDs and many of them are mixes, then you can afford more stuff you don't like.
Burning mixes means you can take 20-30 Basie albums and turn them into 4-5 CDs you really like. Or maybe 20-30 neo swing CDs and turn them into 1 CD you're willing to carry...
That is exactly why I DJ almost exclusively off compilations. And, how even I have at least eight to ten hours of pre-1945 music with me at all times.
However, all of this "evolution" needs to take place gradually in whatever direction it moves. If Paul Overton showed up in a 1996 Neo Swing club playing nothing but Night Train, it never would have happened. Instead, he mixed it in slowly, and it finally caught on and became the rage at Lindy events. If Shorty Dave showed up in 1997 and played a full set of Gene Harris material at a Swing club playing mostly RCR, Louis Jordan, and Benny Goodman, most people frankly would have been stumped. Last year, it became the rage.
Like it or not, there are audiences of pure Lindy Hoppers out there that will cringe at a set full of vintage music. (Just as there might be audiences that will want nothing but vintage music in other venues). There are also audiences that would cringe at a 2-hour set of exclusively Buddy Guy, Gatemouth Brown, and Stevie Ray Vaughn that I would LOVE to be able to get away with playing. (All of which, incidentally, I once thought was completely and entirely "unLindyable" music). Forcing it down their throats for the entire set generally will only make them resent you as a DJ instead of ask you back or look forward to your next DJing.
Same thing with, to get back to the point of the thread, encouraging Neo Swinger newbies to evolve in their musical tastes beyond a thumping, aggressive beat that anticipates instead of relaxes into the rhythm. You can't just play Gatemouth Brown or Django Reinhart and immediately expect them to instantly see the light (or even WANT to see the light). (Although I do submit that they will "see the light" with Lindyable music that is more accessible to their current tastes.)
I understand the notion of pushing the limits/frontier and not just playing what dancers expect to be played 100% of the time. It needs to be done; otherwise, we will be dancing to pretty much the same stuff year after year. And that evolution can include "backwards" steps in sort of "retro" movements if and when not enough traditional swing is played or if and when the evolved music is sappy, lame, or not worthwhile. (Not that it should or will be, but that it can be).kitkat wrote:What do you think? Is striving to make a type of music as pleasurable for the floor as possible a goal equally noble to "pleasing the floor?"
However, all of this "evolution" needs to take place gradually in whatever direction it moves. If Paul Overton showed up in a 1996 Neo Swing club playing nothing but Night Train, it never would have happened. Instead, he mixed it in slowly, and it finally caught on and became the rage at Lindy events. If Shorty Dave showed up in 1997 and played a full set of Gene Harris material at a Swing club playing mostly RCR, Louis Jordan, and Benny Goodman, most people frankly would have been stumped. Last year, it became the rage.
Like it or not, there are audiences of pure Lindy Hoppers out there that will cringe at a set full of vintage music. (Just as there might be audiences that will want nothing but vintage music in other venues). There are also audiences that would cringe at a 2-hour set of exclusively Buddy Guy, Gatemouth Brown, and Stevie Ray Vaughn that I would LOVE to be able to get away with playing. (All of which, incidentally, I once thought was completely and entirely "unLindyable" music). Forcing it down their throats for the entire set generally will only make them resent you as a DJ instead of ask you back or look forward to your next DJing.
Same thing with, to get back to the point of the thread, encouraging Neo Swinger newbies to evolve in their musical tastes beyond a thumping, aggressive beat that anticipates instead of relaxes into the rhythm. You can't just play Gatemouth Brown or Django Reinhart and immediately expect them to instantly see the light (or even WANT to see the light). (Although I do submit that they will "see the light" with Lindyable music that is more accessible to their current tastes.)