When selecting that "token" fast song...

[Mr Awesomer]

You're reading into it far to much. It was simply a change in style. Pull out those archived CDs of yours and listen to Krupa, Webb, and Greer. They were hitting the same cymbals, hitting the same high hats, and you can hear them on the recordings... they are just doing it in a different way.

[main_stem]

In general, Hi-Fi completely changed the way drummers played, as with all musicians. .

Lawrence you are so off on this. Jo Jones of the origional Basie band is the man who changed the way drummers played. He toned down the bass drum sometimes ommiting it all together. He moved the playing of ride rhythms to the high hat while it was opening and closing. This created a constant ringing sound and was more fluid compared to other drummers at the time. Further more he would keep this idea going when playing on a suspended cymbal, which is now called the ride cymbal.


Kevin
Seattle

[Nate Dogg]

Yes, we do have the sweater-vested, vintage-clothed, old-school Hollywood types, here, with the attitude and all catchings. It's still happening in college towns, too, not just down here. If you are correct that "Hollywood is dead," then it might just be that it is just a local, post-fad tag-alongs kind of thing. I don't pay much attention to it besides noticing that a few sweater vests are still out there.

Who, where? Aside from the occasional out of towner who is passing through, I can only think of one or two people who fit the description. And, they spend most of their time dancing out of town, since Austin is too "slow" for them.

[shortyjul]

If you're a good DJ and truly do understand your audience, then you will play to the tastes of the dancers present. Play the good fast music that moves them, the good slow music that moves them, etc... If you're really mixing it up throughout an evening, there will be plenty of great variety across the board keeping the majority happy, but most certainly make sure that any "token" songs thrown out there for the minority are the real deal.

Jesse

Sorry - I am jumping into this quite late. I think I agree with some of the outcome of this statement, but I have to admit that my impetus is a bit different. My experiences (more locally than nationally) have lead me to realize that the general dancing populus is less than knowledgeable about music. I have played at events where I could have played the same friggen' Sam Cooke cd all night long, and the masses would have been thrilled. I like to show people what *I* like - I have really broad tastes - so that they may be exposed to good, new things. Perhaps this isn't "giving people credit," but fuck it - I DJ so I can hear and share the music I love. I'll take some things into consideration, but by far, it's REALLY all about me.

By the same turn, I LOVE it when other good DJs make it all about THEM.

[Nate Dogg]

If you're a good DJ and truly do understand your audience, then you will play to the tastes of the dancers present. Play the good fast music that moves them, the good slow music that moves them, etc... If you're really mixing it up throughout an evening, there will be plenty of great variety across the board keeping the majority happy, but most certainly make sure that any "token" songs thrown out there for the minority are the real deal.

Jesse

Sorry - I am jumping into this quite late. I think I agree with some of the outcome of this statement, but I have to admit that my impetus is a bit different. My experiences (more locally than nationally) have lead me to realize that the general dancing populus is less than knowledgeable about music. I have played at events where I could have played the same friggen' Sam Cooke cd all night long, and the masses would have been thrilled. I like to show people what *I* like - I have really broad tastes - so that they may be exposed to good, new things. Perhaps this isn't "giving people credit," but fuck it - I DJ so I can hear and share the music I love. I'll take some things into consideration, but by far, it's REALLY all about me.

By the same turn, I LOVE it when other good DJs make it all about THEM.

There are reasons that Jesse is the most booked Lindy DJ in the country. His quote, the one you disagree with, is central to his success.

[CafeSavoy]

I have played at events where I could have played the same friggen' Sam Cooke cd all night long, and the masses would have been thrilled.

still djing for isdn i see.

[CafeSavoy]

i agree with Nate Dogg that the question is whether you're djing for yourself
or for the dancers. this is not to say that your djing won't be an expression
of yourself; you have to play true to your personal tastes. besides a dj is like
a leader in that it's always about you since you're calling the moves. but do you
use the opportunity to show your partner a good time, or do you use it for
self-aggrandisement.

[shortyjul]

There are reasons that Jesse is the most booked Lindy DJ in the country. His quote, the one you disagree with, is central to his success.

I am well aware of Jesse's success. He is also well aware of mine. You don't see me knocking his djing in the least. I also think that my tastes are quite in line with many dancers. I just know that I LIKE variety and I LIKE my tastes to be broadened by other swing DJs who love the music. I just am a less magnanimous person than Jesse. My experiences have been shaped by many years of trying to play for a VERY diverse, yet close-minded, crowd. I got fed up with it and now play what I like. The results are great - different than Jesse's, but fine. There should be differences - differences in opinion, motivation, taste. Unless the music is unequivocably crap (i.e. bossa nova, etc.), the differences are what enrich our exposure to music.

(Edited for continuity - I can't speak, how you say, English.)

[jacques_g]

One fast number I really like is Benny Carter's rendition of Perdido. It's over 7 minutes long though.

On the faster tempo stuff:

I like to play music that has a bit of a Dixieland feel to it. It gets the folks to finally use the Charleston stuff they've been learning in class.

I also like to play an occasionnal Boogie - Woogie.

Jacques

[Mr Awesomer]

I originally started this thread by simply asking that DJs of a certain style play better "token" uptempo tunes. I was not embarking on a quest to change DJs. And here is why:

Unless they are a complete and total sell out (and some DJs certainly are, as they seem to want to play whatever SEEMS to keep everyone happy) DJs are going to ALWAYS going to play what THEY like. Period. No matter how much they try and act like they are interested in other peoples tastes, no matter how much they ask for feedback, no matter what information you spoon feed into their asses... they are going to continue to play to their own tastes.

I would expect no less. This is how I operate; the only difference is that I make it clear that I play what I like. No games. If you like it too, awesome, if not you can leave or sit in a corner and bitch until I play my token "groove" song.

By now you're probably saying, "you sound like a big hypocrite!" Hardly... because I practice what I preach. I stick to my guns, but I do slip in that occasional token "groove" songs. And when I do, I make sure it's damn good shit, like Duke Ellington's "Wings and Things" or Nina Simone doing "I've Got It Bad and That Ain't Good" or Sidney Bechet’s "The Blues My Naughty Baby Gave To Me." I don't play "I'd Rather Fuck Muddy Water" and all that other God-awful played out shit. Thus, while a lot of people bitch that I don't play enough "groove," I have always gotten wonderful response when I do actually slip in a "groove" selection.

Again, from the very beginning of this thread, that's all I'm asking for. Just make those "token" selections good.

[Nate Dogg]

Unless they are a complete and total sell out (and some DJs certainly are, as they seem to want to play whatever SEEMS to keep everyone happy) DJs are going to ALWAYS going to play what THEY like. Period. No matter how much they try and act like they are interested in other peoples tastes, no matter how much they ask for feedback, no matter what information you spoon feed into their asses... they are going to continue to play to their own tastes.

I will take your bait...

I think following one taste's and striving to please as many dancers as possible are not mutually exclusive.

Also, some people are genuine when they ask for feedback and try to gauge other people's interests.

[shortyjul]

Well, duh. We are talking of a few extreme examples that have large, reverberating effects.

[Mr Awesomer]

I wasn't talking about a few examples... everyone is like that.

Yeah, I've seen a few people genuinely take in feed back, but it only results in small tweeks to their play lists. It does NOT changes to their overall style, taste, flava or whatever you want to call it.

[lindyholic]

I originally started this thread by simply asking that DJs of a certain style play better "token" uptempo tunes. I was not embarking on a quest to change DJs. And here is why:

Unless they are a complete and total sell out (and some DJs certainly are, as they seem to want to play whatever SEEMS to keep everyone happy) DJs are going to ALWAYS going to play what THEY like. Period. No matter how much they try and act like they are interested in other peoples tastes, no matter how much they ask for feedback, no matter what information you spoon feed into their asses... they are going to continue to play to their own tastes.

I would expect no less. This is how I operate; the only difference is that I make it clear that I play what I like. No games. If you like it too, awesome, if not you can leave or sit in a corner and bitch until I play my token "groove" song.

By now you're probably saying, "you sound like a big hypocrite!" Hardly... because I practice what I preach. I stick to my guns, but I do slip in that occasional token "groove" songs. And when I do, I make sure it's damn good shit, like Duke Ellington's "Wings and Things" or Nina Simone doing "I've Got It Bad and That Ain't Good" or Sidney Bechet’s "The Blues My Naughty Baby Gave To Me." I don't play "I'd Rather Fuck Muddy Water" and all that other God-awful played out shit. Thus, while a lot of people bitch that I don't play enough "groove," I have always gotten wonderful response when I do actually slip in a "groove" selection.

Again, from the very beginning of this thread, that's all I'm asking for. Just make those "token" selections good.

werd

[Lawrence]

In general, Hi-Fi completely changed the way drummers played, as with all musicians. .

Lawrence you are so off on this. Jo Jones of the origional Basie band is the man who changed the way drummers played. He toned down the bass drum sometimes ommiting it all together. He moved the playing of ride rhythms to the high hat while it was opening and closing. This created a constant ringing sound and was more fluid compared to other drummers at the time. Further more he would keep this idea going when playing on a suspended cymbal, which is now called the ride cymbal.
Kevin
Seattle

I don't see how the two are contradictory or how Hi-Fi changing drumming precludes Jo Jones from having already changed drumming, as well. It's not as if only one development ever occurred. Certainly Hi-Fi and finer amplification changed the way that high-hats are played. Small "tings" and finer accents can be heard that previously were not heard. That leads to more subtleties in the cymbal play, which leads to a more "boppish" rhythm, which is distracting to dancers because it accents too much "off" the rhythm. That was what I was getting at and how I interpreted Ruben's "hitting the high hat all the frickin time" comment.

I'm not sure how much it is relevant or essential it is to the topic, anymore, anyway. Like I said, Ruben's point is well taken even if it was a bit quip, as many of his expressions are. (I've never heard of that "Fuck Muddy Water" song... )